Mapoui: explain yourself re Keeper

[BallOil]

Maps..see this...

C.L.R.James writes with great authority on the game and as with anyone, some issues could be debatable. For instance when he avers that the wicket keeping position is not one for the captain.

Link

[mapoui]

dats a nice contribution by Harimohan. he is right about the depth of james. I have seen a few intellects with similar or supassing depth based on the work of theirs I have I read ..

Gerald Massey the great english historian comes to mind, sigmund freud, Frederich engels. it is a surpassing pleasure to read the production of such intellects.

Karl Marx also is up in there but I found the writing styel of James, Massey and Engles to be carriers, so captivating that yu read and read and read and dont feel a thing. and the more you read the more you want to read these guys.

I found Marx to be real hard work! very productive reading indeed but hard, hard work!

CLR James shud be a fourth westindian to be awarded the Nobel.... for literature in his case, like naipaul and Walcott.

but James outdistances both naipaul and Walcott in scope, depth, subject - all of humanity.

James achievd such a synthesis of knowledge as Harimohan points out in just beyond a boundary, he finds sociology in beyond a boundary. and sociology as properly defined is the study of society. and the study of society includes every disciplne known to man.

I believe the term used to describe james is polymath

James production is extraordianry, a list of his books and other literary productions very long inddeed

[mapoui]

James said that keeping is no place for the captain to be.

I agree. too much to do, it requires an extraordinary individual to pull it off successfully. Gerry Alexander was one such out of the ordinary person and player.

Mahendra Singh Soni appears to be another,may even more talented than Alexander was.

Kumar Sangakara has been successful as well although he has given up keeping.

as I have said I see these individual as exceptional, the exceptions who prove the rule, that keeping is no place for the captain to be. I would not be looking for keeper captains at all nbow mater how good these guys are.

if I have one he would have to announce himself and so accede to the throne. but I would not be looking for him..or for a captain who keeps

[BallOil]

Maps...that was then...this is now. We in an era where keepers are expected to bat better than specialist batsmen. Why is that?

[mapoui]

Maps...that was then...this is now. We in an era where keepers are expected to bat better than specialist batsmen. Why is that?

if di'ze true I dont have an proveable answer! jess my own assessment

to me all bowlers and keepers mus' be able to bat to help dem selves..ALL!

batting keepers is a natural part of the development of the game.

there was a time when the majority of bowlers and keepers were rabbits. as the game developed under the pressure of the drive to win, teams were bound to look into areas of performance that were 'neglected' before seeking advantage. such areas obviously wud be and were targeted for imporvement, with the view of winning

look at LLoyds team especially when Dujon came in. not a few times 5 westindian wickets were down for less that 200..even 150..and yet westindies got to 400+. that was because teams could not get past Dujon and the last remaining top order batsman.

Richardson/Dujon...Gomes Dujon...Logie Dujon. at times it was Dujon and the tail...marshall, Holding, Garner.

when yu have such as Dujon, David and deryck Murray, there is very little likelihood dat opposition bowling would be able to run through the batting, save once or twice in the career of a team.

Lloyd with the specific results in mind, purposefully selected those 3 as his keepers. it was lloyds plan, part of his view of what was necessary for westindies to win, in response to hie experience as a test cricketer, his knowelde of the game, its history

Lloyd developed in his mind exactly what he achieved with the westindies team. espcdially Dujon as keeper...who was a specialist batsman with keeping experience, Lloyd turned into the teams keeper

with Lloyds team in 11 years, I dont recall westindies bowled down cheaply more than five times. not even in the 1975 Oz whitewash did we go down for less than 200+ more than once or so if at all

[mapoui]

in 1984 I remember westindies drove Oz nuts by that seventh wicket position.

at least twice in that series..prolly 3 times... deh had knocked over westindies early only to be stopped dead cold by Dujon ton..or big fifty.

another aspect of the game Lloyd developed exponentially is fielding. LLoyds team was and prolly still is the most capable fielding test team ever developed.

watching westindies field n Bang last night brought that fact home more than ever.

it is the sheer pressure of winning for all the reason concerned..a natural development as far as I see...that forces such change and dvelopment in the game. there is modern medical development relevant to athletics that become applied to cricket that extended players physicality much more than previously.

the pressure for money by various other economic sectors that used cricket as a vehicle to extend profits. such expansion demanded professinalism from cricketers for investors and organisations putting money into cricket needed/demanded absolutely consistentcy of performance..whch brought to bear the results of eve more secrtors on crcket..like dieting properly, even to the specifics of each player to the extent individual nutritional requirements as well as fitness programs are now devised.

cricket has come far, along with the general advances experienced in every sector over the last 60 years. all postions and parts of the game has come under pressure to produce a whle effort in achiving consistent winning. the keeper function was bound to suffer this pressure and to respond successfully

[mapoui]

so with the Oz marsh and his successors, the westindians etc..and their immediate predecessors like Knott of england, Alexander of the westindies, Dennis Lindsay of RSA, Engineer of India..we have had a flowering of the keeping position, now a precedent for those we have and to come...that must be followed in the game.

based on that I expect other keepers to be as good all-rounders as Jacobs, Dujon, Marsh and Gilchrist and the rest.

the batting of the keepers has become such a part of the mix now that when it is absent, as it is with Ramdin and Baugh it is sorely missed...rather felt and experienced as a cost of the losses we now endure.

the poor batting of our current keepers now stand out and become a source of contention in team selection.

when it is insisted that the keeper is a specialist position first and foremost, and ought to be selected just on that fact, that is a backwardness, a denial of the development that has taken place since 1960.

the specilisation is now all-rounder, keeper/batsman

it is truncation and a redcution of a powerful development in the game we ought not to lose, but to enhance if we can

[mapoui]

westindies are poorly served by Baugh and Ramdin. deh are not all-round and therefore not consistent with advance in the game.

westindies shud have been looking elsewhere already and they might be indeed looking. Kyle Corbin appears to be the best coming bet to keep up with the progress.

also young keepers must be made to understand early dat batting is an essential component of their trade. if they cant bat forget it. young keepers must be made aware that the position is an all-round one..period.

Ramdin was a sound, promising, excellent young prospect who could bat. when I saw him at first I saw shades of Dujon. I thought we had a worthy successor especialy with his early success in Oz.

but Ramdin has declined..or rather not developed as a batsman... and thats a problem indeed.

and as a batsman Baugh is prolly worse, with a decided weakness against spin.

as far a i am concered it is time to move on from those 2 guys, to Corbin, not Devon Thomas.

and to move also to a clear coaching and developmental focus on the all-round keeper.

the specialist keeper, a rabbit with the bat, who came in at 10 or 11 is done and was an easy out, is dead in the game, and we must not seek to revive him. let him rest in peace and comfort certain that his job is done, and now morphed into a solid advance

[BallOil]

Mapoui I'm not done with you on this topic... I just digg out CLR Jame book and looking for that part.

[mapoui]

look towards the end and his campaign to get worrell appointed captain over alexander