West Indies Cricket Fans

before I get to the bibliography let me explain my critique of gayle that led to this silly imbroglio! but not from my side of the equation

it shud have been very clear the irony in the situation, the fact that Gyale himself is the one who started the selection of many unworthy players on the westindies side, leaving out the worthy ones.

and all Gayles trouble stems from the very wicb that aquiesced in is nonsense then, and now engage in that very nonsense itself..selecting unworthy players one of whom is the captain of the team... which threatens gayles position on the westindies team and his international standing.

Shivenarine Chanderpaul also colluded with this very wicb against the general interest of the players and fans, and also now find himself under pressure from the very arbitrariness he supported in his time.

it is right and sensible to support the retention of the seniors for the case is logical and right...practical. but it must be pointed out the failure of both Gayle and Chandrpaul to read and react accurately, positively at their decisive points...in which case westindies cricket would have been disciplined differently and would not have led to this current pass or situation of even further decline.

I was pointing out the failure of the two men who had they both been more capable, as capable as Lloyd or Worrell were...even Kanhai was...westindies would never have deteririated from their points to this lower one.

I called gayle the UN-Worrell to highlight the difference and the consequences between the men and the time..then as to now. also to highlight the quality of leadership westindies needed to move forward

Now what was wrong with that, that warranted a double barrelled response from AFRO and Daro was it?

RACE BEFORE WICKET Christopher Searle
(http://rac.sagepub.com/content/31/3/31.extract" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) PDF File

AN AREA OF CONQUEST Edited by Hilary Becjkes
in here can be found:
Imperialism, Colonial Education and the Origins of Westindies Cricket
Keith Sandiford

Ethnicity, Class and Democratization of West Indies Cricket
Trevor Marshall

The Radical Tradition in the Culture of West Indies Cricket
Hilary Beckles

Cricket and the Origins of Federation Organisations
June Soomer

West Indian nationhod, Integration and Cricket Politics
Tim Hector

Cricket and West Indian Society
Michael manley

LIBERATION CICKET Hilary Beckles
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Liberation-Cric ... 0719043158" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Cricket and Empire R Sissons & B Stoddart

Anyone But England Mike Marquessee
a masterpiece of social analysis centred on cricket

the Politics of Sport & the Changing Politics of Sport
Lincoln Allison

Caribean Cricket: The Role of Sporting Emerging Small Nation Politics
B Stoddart

How Cricket is Westindain Cricket? Class, Racial and Colour Conflict
(Caribbean Review Vol 12, 1983
O'Brien Thompson

Cricket Literature and the Politics of Decolonization: The Case of CLR James
Helen Tiffin

Class, race and Cricket in barbadian Society
Trevor marshall


and this is just a small section of the total literature on westindian and world cricket that is based entirely on race and politics.

NO WONDER AFRO AND DARO DONT KNOW ABOUT ALL THIS BECAUSE THEY DONT LIKE TO READ ABOUT BLAC THIS AND WHITE THAT AND BROWN ..SKIN COLOUR IN CRICKET. THEY WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO READ THESE BOOKS BECAUSE THEY ARE FILLED WITH ANALYSIS OF RACE, RACISM AND SKIN COLOUR

AND THEY COULD NOT DO MUCH BETTER WITH GENERAL WESTINDIAN LITERATURE FOR THAT TOO IS FILLED WITH RACE.... FOR WHAT ELSE CAN THE LITERATURE BE FILLED WITH GIVEN THAT RACE AND RACISM IS THE VERY WAY WE HAVE LIVED FOR CENTURIES, CENTRAL TO OUR VERY LIVING ROUTINE EXPERIENCE OF LIFE.

so what is weird, ridiculous, out of tune and sync with all I say if I am dealing with what I know to be westindian life...a life I grew up in? what is narrow about it, racist, prejudiced?

and if I am racially prejudiced somebody pray tell me how it could have been different given where I was born and grew?

and somebdy tell me how it can possibly be different with Daro, AFRO and with all who post here who grew up n the westindies?

indeed with all westindians...for any of us to be free from the racism that is embedded in our regular, routine life we would have to take off our a skin and grow a different one in some diferent location

I AM NOT GOING TO SPEND TIME ON ANY WESTINDIAN CRICKET MSB TALKING NARROW NONSENSE, STUPIDITY, INANE EFFERY WHEN I KNOW BETTER.

I AM NOT GOING TO DELIBERATELY DUMB MYSELF DOWN TO SUIT ANYONES SENSE OF PROPRIETY.

AND ANY SENSE OF PROPRIETY THAT IS CARIBBEAN GROWN THAT DOES NOT WANT TO DISCUSS RACISM AS A FACT OF WESTINDIAN LIFE, TO DISCOVER ITS TRUE CONTOURS AND SO BE ABLE TO DO SOMETHING POSITIVE ABOUT IT, IS A FOOLISH, INACCUATE AND DANGEROUS OUTLOOK.

IT IS DANGEROUS BECAUSE IT CANNOT CALL TRUTH BY ITS NAME, REFUSES TO DEAL WITH TRUTH, DOES NOT WANT TO BE SMART BY KNOWING ITS WORLD AS IT IS, DENIES REALITY.. AND WHEN THE SITUATION PRECIPITATES CRISIS, REQUIRING POSITIVE AND ACCURATE RESPONSE TO PREVENT OR END CATASTROPHE, SUCH AN OUTLOOK WOULD BE HELPLESS.

I, WE, MUST COME OUT OF ALL THIS TALK BETTER OFF, MORE AWARE OF AND ATTUNED TO OUR WESTINDIAN PERSONALITIES, INDENTITIES, REALITY. WE MUST BE DOING SOMETHING THAT MAKES US BETTER OR WHY DO IT AT ALL? AND IN DOING SO WE CANNOT LIMIT OUTSELVES TO LIMITS LIFE HAS ALREADY OUTSTRIPPED

if I cannot speak what I see to be the truth, what I investigate and prove to be truthful, what I see is good evidence suggesting that a situation is in fact a certain way...if that is greeted by silly, stupid, grinning and ignorant disparagement constantly, then I simply will not post, leaving the space to the foolishness to proliferate uncontested. let the stupidity grown till it trips itself over and cant get up for it forgot how to walk...got bloated on its own foolishness

i will simply move on and do other things. but there is no way in this day and age I am going to fight people like AFRO on these issues which are long resolved and are now part of the conscious of intelligent people...like Bryond a Boundary that has been read to pieces by most cricket lovers and it is now part of their consciousness, part of the general consciousness of intelligent cricket save a few people here.
the scholarly Mike brearly delivering a lecture in Port of Spain recently suggested a Nobel for CLR James,noting the greatnesss of the work he accomplished. and all james spoke about was intricately bound up with race, racism, politics and economics and cricket..all bound up in the process of life...whole

I dont mind disagreement and debate. I love that. I tried that with the man but it was pointless. I tried to ignore him..no use! to hell with it then

AFRO wrote:edited

DID YU EDIT THAT bALLY?

LET THE MAN SPEAK! IN DOING SO HE DENIGRATES NO ONE BUT HIMSELF!

HE DOES NOT WANT TO HEAR SPEAK NOR TALK ABOUT RACE WHEN JUST ABOUT THE ENTIRE LITERATURE, OF ROUTINE TALK AND GENERAL COMMENTARY ON CRICKET IS AN ANALYSIS OF RACE RELATIONS IN THE BRITISH EMPIRE FOR 150 YEARS.

AND WHY THIS IS SO...BECAUSE RACISM WAS THE CHIEF PILLAR UPON WHICH IMPERIAL CONTROL WAS BASED, AND SINCE THE AGE OF INDEPENDENCE BEGAN THE NATIONS WHICH ONCE MADE UP THE BRITISH EMPIRE HAVE HAD TO DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF RACE IN THEIR SEACRH FOR GENERAL LIBERATION FROM THE PAST CONQUEST AND DOMINATION ON ALL LEVELS OF LIFE, PHYSICAL AS WELL AS MENTAL?

BallOil wrote:Who is Gong Lee?

di'ze mih bwoy googs...he chinese name from next door! or is it googs lee? or goog lee!

watever

jess having fun. is goog lee on wicf!

come on Mapoui, this selection nonsense didn't started with Gayle. If the board had a spine they could have stopped it .. . Selection in WI cricket has always been an issue.

They don't even have a policy on selection, with a set of criteria, etc

mapoui wrote:

BallOil wrote:Who is Gong Lee?

di'ze mih bwoy googs...he chinese name from next door! or is it googs lee? or goog lee!

watever

jess having fun. is goog lee on wicf!

Looks like your bwoy suffering from multiple personalities.

mapoui wrote:RACE BEFORE WICKET Christopher Searle
(http://rac.sagepub.com/content/31/3/31.extract" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) PDF File

AN AREA OF CONQUEST Edited by Hilary Becjkes
in here can be found:
Imperialism, Colonial Education and the Origins of Westindies Cricket
Keith Sandiford

Ethnicity, Class and Democratization of West Indies Cricket
Trevor Marshall

The Radical Tradition in the Culture of West Indies Cricket
Hilary Beckles

Cricket and the Origins od Federation Organisations
June Soomer

West Indian nationhod, Integration and Cricket Politics
Tim Hector

Cricket and West Indian Society
Michale manley

LIBERATION CICKET Hilary Beckles
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Liberation-Cric ... 0719043158" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Cricket and Empire R Sissons & B Stoddart

Anyone But England Mike Marquessee
a masterpiece of social analysis centred on cricket

th Politics of Sport & the Changing Politics of Sport
Lincoln Allison

Caribean Cricket: The Role of Sporting Emerging Small Nation Politics
B Stoddart

How Cricket is Westindain Cricket? Class, Racial and Colour Conflict
(Caribbean Review Vol 12, 1983
O'Brien

Cricket Literature and the Politics of Decolonization: The Case of CLR James
Helen Tiffin

Class, race and Cricket in barbadian Society
Trevor marshall


and this is just a small section of the total literature on westindian and world cricket that is based entirely on race and politics.

Excellent list Bro... Thanks for this.. Please check your PM...thx

BallOil wrote:come on Mapoui, this selection nonsense didn't started with Gayle. If the board had a spine they could have stopped it .. . Selection in WI cricket has always been an issue.

They don't even have a policy on selection, with a set of criteria, etc

WHEN i SAY STARTED i MEAN IN A CURRENT SENSE..THIS PERIOD HERE!

as I pointed out there was the example of Atkinson in 1955...Goddard in 1957.

but before, from 1928 to 1939, a captain on ability and competence on the field was never even considered. a lot of the selections were unworthy..like the one that kept Chatterpaul Seepersaud off the 1939 team.

Seepersaud was Guyanese and the Guyanese Peter Bayley was selected before him. Bayley was white and not very good.

between 1948 and 1961 players like McWatt, Ali Binns, Goddard, Gomez, the Atkinson brothers, Robin Bynoe, Bunny Butler, Bruce pairadeau, Kenny Trestrail, Simpson Guillen...all of these are players who were totally unworthy of selection and all were white or near white people

I am demonstrating how westindian blac and brown men, even those from the lower classes... are now tripping up, making the situation worse, killing the game....where in the past blac men in particular were the bringers of progress.

if gayle was like Worrell or Lloyd what wud he have done? would he have resigned in frustratuon over nothing, then hold westindies cricket to ranson in order to continue, feeling himself and his leadership indispensible?

when Lloyd was horribly defeated, so badly we felt westindies would never rise up again from the dust we were pounded into...he regrouped and began to build a side he believed would defeat the world. he had his vision and against odds put it into effect.

is gayle that sort of chap? he is not. Gayle played very insular and backward games which have now come back to bite him...and westindies cricket.

and of course shive has his own- let down up in there too.

ok...got ya on Gayle. Do you want to elaborate on Shiv? What is your take on Lara as a leader, since Lara came back after Shiv?